Armchair Historians

Montford: The Chickasaw Rancher, Jeannie Barbour

January 11, 2022 Jeannie Barbour
Armchair Historians
Montford: The Chickasaw Rancher, Jeannie Barbour
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Show Notes Transcript

In this episode of Armchair Historians, Anne Marie talks to Jeannie Barbour. Jeannie is the Content Producer of the recently released film, Montford: The Chickasaw Rancher starring Martin Sensmeier, Tommy Flanagan, Dermot Mulroney, and Grace Montie. The movie brings to life the true rags to riches story of Montford T. Johnson who built a cattle ranching empire on the Western plains of Indian Territory. It “tells of his time among settlers, cowboys, tribes, military, and bandits. Armed with grit and determination, Montford had the courage that was needed to tame what seemed an infinite wilderness, while always maintaining respect for those who lived there.”

Jeannie Barbour received a degree in fine arts from Oklahoma State University. Upon graduation, she entered the field of advertising and served as an illustrator and writer for various Oklahoma City public relations firms. In 1987, she decided to pursue a career in tribal government by taking a position at the Chickasaw Nation. During that time, she has served on the Oklahoma Film Commission, the National Trail of Tears advisory board and graduated from the prestigious Leadership Oklahoma program. Jeannie is a graduate of the University of Denver’s Publishing Institute and has completed graduate course work in museum studies and Native American history. She has written for a variety of books and periodicals focused on southeastern tribal history and culture. Her award-winning artwork hangs in public spaces and private collections throughout the United States. Jeannie currently serves as the Creative Director for the Chickasaw Nation’s Department of Communications.

Montford: The Chickasaw Rancher: Website: http://www.chickasawrancher.com
Jeannie Barbour Bio: http://www.chickasawrancher.com/Cast-Crew/Crew/Jeannie-Barbour
Chickasaw Nation Productions: http://www.chickasawfilms.com
Chickasaw Nation Website: https://chickasaw.net

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Anne Marie Cannon:

Hello, my name is Anne Marie cannon and I'm the host of armchair historians. What's your favorite history? Each episode begins with this one question. Our guests come from all walks of life. YouTube celebrities, comedians, historians, even neighbors from the small mountain community that I live in. There are people who love history and get really excited about a particular time, place, or person from our distant or not so distant past. The jumping off point is the place where they became curious, then entered the rabbit hole into discovery, fueled by an unrelenting need to know more, we look at history through the filter of other people's eyes. I'm Chair historians is a Belgian rabid production. Stay up to date with us through Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram. Wherever you listen to your podcast that is where you'll find us. I'm Chair historians as an independent, commercial free podcast. If you'd like to support the show and keep it ad free, you can buy us a cup of coffee through coffee, or you can become a patron through Patreon links to both in the Episode Notes. Hello, fellow armchair historians and welcome to our first episode of 2022. Before I introduce this week's guests, I'd like to announce that coming in 2022 we will release two special edition limited series about some of my favorite people in history. The first is someone I've been studying for years. His name is Charles H. Utter no Charlie is better known by the nickname here and in Deadwood, South Dakota during the 1870s. Colorado Charlie, to me Colorado Charlie is one of the most intriguing characters I have come across in the wild west. If you haven't heard of him. Well, that's a shame and I'm fixing to change that. often associated with his friend Wild Bill Hickok. Charlie has left historical breadcrumbs, which lead to one of the most underappreciated, yet compelling characters to have appeared in the 19th century historical landscape. I'll tell you, the more I uncover about the man who paid for Wild Bill's funeral and penned the Cowboys epitaph, the more enigmatic he becomes. The other 19th century historical figure I'd like to introduce you guys to is a woman named Claire Brown. Claire was born into slavery around 1800 and at the age of 59, she at long last was given her freedom. With a civil war on the horizon. Clara joins a wagon train headed for the Kansas territory today's Colorado, and helps a finding her daughter whom she was separated from along with the rest of her children, and has been when they were sold off to different masters. Needless to say, Clara faced many difficulties throughout her life, and not only survived she prosper. After the Civil War, Clara is driven by a desire to go back to the south and try and locate family and friends to bring them back to the Kansas territory. You may be asking yourself now, how did she plan on bringing people to the Kansas territory? And was she successful? If you want to find out more about Clara and what happens to her, be sure to tune in to this limited series. Now I would like to introduce this week's guests. Genie barber Genie is a content producer of the recently released film Mumford, the Chickasaw rancher starring Martin sense Meyer, Tommy Flanagan, Durbin Mulrooney and Grace Monty. The movie brings to life the true rags to riches story of mine for T Johnson, who built a cattle ranching empire on the western plains of Indian territory. It quote tells of his time among settlers, cowboys, tribes, military and bandits. Armed with grit and determination, Mumford had the courage that was needed to tame what seemed an infinite wilderness, while always maintaining respect for those who lived there. And quote, Jamie Barber, welcome, and thank you for being here today.

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, thank you for having me. This is such an honor.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Oh, I'm honored. I did watch the movie yesterday and did a little internet dive into Munford. But why don't we just start out with the question. What is your favorite history that we're going to be talking about today?

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, my favorite history is that of our own tribe, the Chickasaw. I've always been interested in the oral traditions of our people. All those stories that our ancestors have passed down from generation to generation, about our origins, our relationships with others, and the impact that our people have had on important may events in history. And these stories, they helped instill cultural identity. And they and they help to remind us of our inherent sovereignty. So this type of history, for me is part of who I am. And my connection to my tribe.

Anne Marie Cannon:

That's beautiful. That is, one thing I admire is that oral tradition that's passed down. And, you know, being my mother came from France, my father was Irish, that type of thing. We don't really have that. And I, when I hear you talk about that I feel a void. But specifically, we're going to talk about the movie. So why don't you tell us about the movie?

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, the movie is about Manfra Johnson, we started production on it with pre production, which is basically gathering research and history, trying to find out as much as we could about this extraordinary man who really built a cattle empire in a part of Indian territory, which was Oklahoma previously to statehood. And what it took to do that in this vast wilderness where there wasn't a whole lot that he could rely on, but the natural resources, and as a results, there were eight towns in the state of Oklahoma that came into existence because he had a ranching operation somewhere nearby, and it spanned at the height he had over 35,000 head of cattle grazing on over 1.3 million acres in what is now Oklahoma so he was able to come from absolutely nothing after the Civil War and and build this economic foundation for a while the state of Oklahoma would, would eventually become

Anne Marie Cannon:

your the content producer for Chickasaw production. See, you have your own production company,

Jeannie Barbour:

the Chickasaw Nation started a video and feature film production company called Chickasaw Nation productions, back in 2009. And it is a result of a vision that our leadership namely governor, Bill, Anna, Toby had to bring our stories to audiences to help to not only entertain, but to help educate about who we are in what we do, and really our rich, rich history. And it's a history that we are able to tell from our own perspective, which we feel very fortunate to be able to do. First film was about a young girl, Pearl, Carter Scott, who was an aviator x one of the youngest in history. And it was an interesting story. And it was, it was great because it showed what a person could do if they really put their mind to it, even a young person like she was at age 12. And then we decided to feature a beloved member of our tribe. Her name was Mary Thompson, who became the entertainer known as Tejada. And now another strong female within our tribe that was able to fight against discrimination and oppression during a time period when federal assimilation policies were being put in to place for for Native people as far as their culture and religious beliefs and such language. And so the third film was our opportunity to talk about a strong male figure, somebody that was not only hard as nails, you had to be to be on the western wilderness in Indian Territory, but also who cared deeply about his neighbors, no matter who they were, no matter what tribe they were with, or if they were white. He was beloved in Indian Territory. Everybody knew that if they needed help, they could go to Manfra job Johnson. If they needed a job. He had these these cattle opera Asians throughout Chickasaw Nation. So it was he was an extraordinary figure in and just somebody with a life that lent itself to film and an action feature, which, you know, we hadn't done before. So it was an opportunity to talk about Indian Territory history about this man, and really what it took in order to not only survive, but to prosper.

Anne Marie Cannon:

There's big names in this movie.

Jeannie Barbour:

Yes, we found early on when we started making feature films, that if you had a good script, something that told a story that was important that you could attract big name actors like Martin since Meyer, and Dermot Mulroney, Korean culture from Tejada, she played the lead role in Tejada and you know, just so many wonderful actors that we've had the opportunity to bring our characters to life, simply because they had an appreciation for the scripts that were put together.

Anne Marie Cannon:

The other thing about the movie is that I, I like to kind of fact check and see what if it lines up, you know, because sometimes you have to take creative license to tell the story and get the, the emotion across. But it seems like from what I've read, it's pretty true to life. Is that correct?

Jeannie Barbour:

The vast majority of the stories in our films are pretty true to life. We do take creative license in character development, in some cases, simply because there may be three or four friends of Tejada that we combined into one friend so that the audience isn't having to try and keep up with all of these different people. It's still the same story, it's still the same information being relayed only we have combined that also, you know, we had to decide, okay, what parts of these people's lives are we going to concentrate on? With Tejada, we decided, since she lived to be almost 100 years old, that we really needed to make that decision. And so we went from childhood up to the Great Depression, which, you know, a lot more of her story took place after that all the way up into the 1990s. But you really had to make, you know, hard decisions about what are we going to tell what is the direction this story's gonna go in? And what part of history do we want to relay with this character? With Manfra? Johnson, we try to show how he came from absolute poverty to that success and the different events, which there were tremendous events happening during, you know, his lifetime, but which events? Did he have impact? And actually, you know, participated in in a major way, in Indian Territory.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Did the Florida thing really happened? Did he go to Florida?

Jeannie Barbour:

Yes, he did. That really happened. Living in Indian Territory and trying to range cattle, you know, over vast areas, you had to get along with your neighbors, the people that lived in those areas. And there were a lot of First Americans from other tribes that he made agreements with, in order to do that. And it was during a time when the Red River wars were still going on. And there were Indian people from those tribes that were being persecuted in many ways. Their food source was being killed off with the buffalo slaughters that were going on. But you know, there was a moment in history when the leadership of a lot of these tribes were rounded up and sent off to Fort Marion. And these were friends of mine for Johnsons and he had done business with for years who he had gone to, you know, their events and things that he knew their families and things that were important to them. And so when he found out about what had happened, he and some of his family members traveled to Florida to see if there was anything He could do to try and have these, these people released. We don't know, for certain whether he had an effect. But they were released not soon after, after his visit to Florida, but it was the first time for him to see the ocean and really experience a different state and travel. So it was, it was interesting for him. And it's written quite a bit about in his his son's memoirs, Edward Bryant Johnson.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Yeah, the cinematography was lovely. And that was such a stark contrast, you know, being at the ocean, and yet it was so beautiful. And I could I got that sense that, you know, he was in the water, and he was really soaking it up. And not much was really sad about being there. But I got that sense that it was such a different place for him. And, gosh, there were so many things about this movie that I loved. And I don't want to say too much about the movie because I want people to watch it. I have a friend who in fact, he was on the show, and his family owns a ranch. They were homesteaders back in the 1800s in New Mexico, and we had the great pleasure of going there this past summer. And I called him up last night. I'm like, Les, you have to watch this movie. You are going to relate to it. You're gonna love it. Yeah, it's in. That's the other thing. It's a cowboy movie.

Jeannie Barbour:

It is it most definitely is. We have the stampedes. We've got you know the shootouts, we have the bad guys and the good guy. So it most definitely is a cowboy movie. But that was his life. He was a cowboy. true sense of the word cowboy. It's different to see a Native American in that role. Traditionally, you don't.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Yeah, so he looks kind, he also looks rough and tumble at the same time. So and the other thing that I loved about the movie, and the story was, you do see this cross section, it's not just the tribe, you get a full sense of the landscape of people that are living during that time, and that he's coming into contact, and that he's interacting with. And I thought that was really interesting.

Jeannie Barbour:

It was set a time during Indian territory where more and more non First Americans were entering in to the territory, and homesteading, settling, putting together settlements and, and establishing towns and we were already there. And we were always a tribe that was inclusive, and hope to do business with other people no matter who they were. So and I think that's still true today. We are very inclusive tribe even today. So it's it's part of his story and many stories of Chickasaw families, how they came to Indian Territory, of course, it was on Chickasaw removal, in starting in 1837. And how they were able to rebuild and create a life in this new place after being taken out of their homelands. So it really is a triumphant story. And and one of that is shared by all Chickasaw people. And nearly every Chickasaw family has a personal, you know, removal story and a story about Indian Territory.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Do you want to talk a little bit more about removal? And what that means?

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, it's a sad time in our history, it is we choose to focus on really the fact that we not only survived removal, but we have prospered and have learned from that event, as well as many, many events prior to that. We still deal with misunderstandings and difficulty. Even today. When people look at us as a sovereign nation. There's not always a lot of understanding of what that means. So we hope that these movies help to clarify and to show people history, from our perspective, how it was for us and not in a negative way. We are, I think a very positive People and inclusive people. And so I think those are the under one of the underlying themes of the films and documentaries that we put together. As part of these, these projects that we do, we also create a curriculum for the public school system. So there is like a three component project that is produced where we have the feature film, which is on Netflix, we also have a documentary, and that covers the same information and expands it somewhat. So that we take in more of Manfra Johnson's life, and then a curriculum with activities and lessons that can be taught in in the public schools, and we've had very good response to that from the school teachers who have utilized the projects in the classroom. So we're very happy.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Yeah. So is this just an Oklahoma? Or is it school systems throughout the United States,

Jeannie Barbour:

school systems throughout the United States have contacted us, especially those schools in what was our traditional homelands? Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee, those states, you know, don't have a whole lot of information about the tribes that were there prior to removal. So it's an opportunity for students to see history from our perspective, and how how these things impacted individuals, as well as the tribe as a whole.

Anne Marie Cannon:

So if somebody in a school system was interested in bringing this curriculum to their schools, who would, how would they do that, all they

Jeannie Barbour:

have to do is contact us@chickasaw.com. Or, you know, the phone number that's listed, and they will be connected with the folks that send it out. So And what's nice about the curriculum for Oklahoma teachers is that it is designed in a way that it fits with protocols and the various things that the state of Oklahoma requires for social studies. And for for history. So it fits with all of the different needs in the classroom that are required by state law.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Is there one thing that you would want to leave my listeners with to know about this history? If there was one thing that they could retain? What would you want them to know

Jeannie Barbour:

about Chickasaw history as a whole or about Munford Johnson, about man for Johnson, that anything is possible, that with enough guts and fortitude, with enough ingenuity, and hard work, you can achieve just about anything, this man suffered from chronic illness and family trauma throughout his life, yet, he's a self made man. And he managed to build a family legacy within Oklahoma that continues to be celebrated today. And there are his descendants still living, which a lot of our research and a lot of the information that we gathered to create or recreate Montfort on film was actually taken from months of meeting with these folks, and getting to know Montfort through their eyes, through their family. And he was somebody who's extraordinary, in a lot of different ways that the legacy that he leaves is, is just unsurpassed.

Anne Marie Cannon:

He had a lot of children. And I noticed in the credits, because I watched the credits that there were a lot of Johnson's that were involved in the making of the film, either his extras or different things. So I'm wondering, I'm wondering, like, there are, there must be a lot of descendants. And I'm wondering if there's descendants who don't even know that they're descendants of this great man.

Jeannie Barbour:

I'm sure that there are. There are I mean, he, he not only raised children from two different wives, but also several orphans. He arranged to to care for and raise several orphans. So yes, there there probably are. I told you the wrong website is Chickasaw dotnet.

Anne Marie Cannon:

So yeah, I was actually looking at ancestry and kind of got the lowdown on his family and all of his children and Nope, he had some children that did noteworthy things as well. I saw that there is a I'm really digressing on this now, but I saw that there's a, a famous golfer or something. Yes, named Mr. T. Johnson. And I'm like, that has to be the same family.

Jeannie Barbour:

Oh, yeah. Yeah. He is related. Oh, and there are several Monforte. T Johnston's out there, all of them related to my firt. I've found so far. But, yes, and keeping them all straight has been difficult.

Anne Marie Cannon:

I bet I bet. So, where can my listeners see the movie? Find out more, if they want to, you know, find out more, where can they go.

Jeannie Barbour:

They can find out more on Chickasaw dotnet. Or they can Google Chickasaw Nation productions. All the movies and documentaries that are out there are listed, as well as the cast and the crew and, you know, information about how the movies were put together, they can contact us at the tribe. And there will be, you know, lots of people willing to talk about Chickasaw Nation productions. And what we do, it's been just a very rewarding and wonderful thing for me to have the opportunity to, to work on these productions, because I love the history so much. But having the opportunity to meet with the families of these extraordinary people that we feature in our films and documentaries, that that is the true joy because you get a part of history that's not written down from these families, and you get a better sense of really how these lives took place in the context of the times that they lived in. And that is really an exciting thing to, to, to be a part of.

Anne Marie Cannon:

You're a very talented woman, because I did do a little research on you, as well. And I saw an interview, you're you were an illustrator, you illustrated a children's book. I don't know, if you want to talk about that. But I thought that was kind of interesting.

Jeannie Barbour:

Yes, I did. Traditionally, our people have shared oral stories strictly, verbally, you know, they've passed them from one generation to the next. And that has been the traditional way of sharing history and stories. And we found a few years ago that we were losing a lot of our stories with the elders that were passing on. And so there, there was a concern. And we approached some of our elders that carried this responsibility and explained, you know, we have this concern, and they agreed that it was time to write these, these stories down. And so I was approached, to illustrate a three volume set of Chickasaw stories, traditional stories. And so our our press, we have a press, the Chickasaw press, who publishes books, I did illustrate those storybooks. And it was it's so exciting, because that's actually what my degree is in fine arts from Oklahoma State. And so I had the opportunity to actually use that knowledge to illustrate these wonderful stories. And so they too can be found at Chickasaw dotnet. If people are interested there are both in the Chickasaw language and in English.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Oh, okay. They're beautiful illustrations, too. They're colorful, they're, you know, draw you in, from what I saw. Yeah. Is there anything that I didn't ask you that you want to share with my audience

Jeannie Barbour:

as far as casting, we have a policy where we will always try and cast first American actors in first American roles. And that hasn't always been the case in the past for, you know, Hollywood films representing native people. But it is our goal not only to cast, actors, actresses, but also crew. So we also have First Americans serving on our crew behind the cameras as well as actors in front of the cameras and really, it's it's so rewarding. We we bring in people from just a vast array of tribes wanting to participate in a film that is produced by a Native American tribe, because it just isn't. And we, we embrace them and embrace, you know, their efforts, that, you know, they want to tell the Chickasaw story as well as accurately as they can. And so it's been wonderful, the experiences that we've had with these actors and with these crew members. So it's, it's something that we think is bigger than just the stories, the stories are definitely important. But it's also an opportunity to provide work and to provide First Americans with an opportunity to go into filmmaking or to continue in a career in filmmaking, which, you know, sometimes those opportunities aren't provided.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Yeah, I did notice that, you know, you talk about that even in the credits.

Jeannie Barbour:

And it was also important to represent other tribes when we represent other tribes, that we go to those tribes, and make sure that what we're saying and what we're doing is correct. So we had cultural consultants from the Cheyenne, who talked to us about the character rising Wolf and his wives. There's 500 Different more than 500 Different tribes in the United States. They all have different languages, different cultural beliefs. We all have different societies. And so it's important, you know, to talk to the people who know about their own culture before you start representing it. And so we felt that was also important in in what we do.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Well, it was a beautiful movie. I'm gonna link out to where people can watch it. So where can people watch the movie again?

Jeannie Barbour:

The mom proved that Chickasaw rancher can be seen on Netflix. It's streaming on Netflix now. And also it can be found on Amazon. And Tejada can be found on Netflix as well.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Good. I'll have to add that to my queue.

Jeannie Barbour:

I would definitely watch Tejada it's, it's very inspiring, especially for women.

Anne Marie Cannon:

I love it. Yeah. I love a good woman perseveres story. So is there anything else?

Jeannie Barbour:

I think we've covered everything be looking for more Chickasaw Nation productions in the future. Yeah,

Anne Marie Cannon:

I would love to have you back on and I promise I'll get the technical difficulties worked out. Anyways, I'm really sorry about that. I'm embarrassed. But thank you for reaching out. I really, you know, I'm looking for this kind of these kinds of histories that of people we don't know about that are important, and I love what you're doing and that you're willing to share it. So thank you.

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, thank you for watching Manford, the Chickasaw rancher tell your friends.

Anne Marie Cannon:

Oh, yeah. Yeah, well, I live in Colorado. So there's a lot of, you know, cowboy types out here. And it's it. I think it appeals to a lot of different types of people. So oh,

Jeannie Barbour:

we think our stories are universal. We think that anybody can watch our stories and find themselves and then

Anne Marie Cannon:

yeah, definitely. Well, thank you for being here today. And hopefully, we'll have an opportunity to talk again about your future projects.

Jeannie Barbour:

Well, thank you. I've enjoyed it.

Anne Marie Cannon:

There you have it. Jamie barber content producer of Monforte, the Chickasaw rancher streaming now on Netflix and Amazon. Be sure to check out our episode notes to find out more about the movie, Genie barber Chickasaw productions and Chickasaw Nation. Thanks for joining us. Have a great week.